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Dr. Lynch product Q&AUpdated 2 hours ago

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Looking for you easiest on the stomach form of mthfr support. Struggle with nausea on most supplements. Would like a multivitamin or b complex but understand if it just needs to be something simpler like this methyl b12 and methylfolate product. 

I prefer knowing what symptoms you're looking to support vs just saying you need MTHFR support.

I say this because just because you have a MTHFR variant does NOT mean you need to supplement.

Depends.

  • Is your homocysteine elevated - above 9 umol/L?
  • are you low mood?
  • are you low energy?
  • is your head heavy?
  • do you have difficulty thinking and want to support healthy cognition?

If you say yes to any of these, then the Methyl B12 with L Methylfolate lozenges would be a great fit - and start with 1/2 a lozenge.

They are very easy on the stomach.

I would consider starting with a more foundational approach though vs this targeted supplement.

Consider:

  • Glutathione Plus Lozenge: 1/2 a lozenge upon waking
  • Optimal Man: 1 capsule after a protein based breakfast
  • Optimal Electrolyte: 1 serving sometime midday
  • Bile Nutrients: 2 capsules before dinner to support a healthy digestion and stomach response to supplements and food.*

Our supplements are usually very well tolerated as we use chelated minerals, not tablets and high quality ingredients.

I'd start with the four supplements above and I suspect you'll feel way better ;) in 24 hours.

In health,
Dr. Lynch



Thank for writing me back, I know that everyone has the genes , mine came back with a mthrf and comt issue. Looking for support with mood, energy and stress but can’t afford a lot of supplements. If I could only pick one what would you suggest. Trying to handle most of it with food and lifestyle. Also I have read your book, thanks for making it easy to read for people that don’t have a science brain. 😊 

I'd start with either Optimal Electrolyte or Glutathione Plus Lozenge.

One or both of these is a key starting point.

You'd have 1 serving upon waking and another midday.

Make sure you're eating protein with each meal. This is key. Do not start your day with caffeine, sugar and carbs. That will wreck your day.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


If you have the mthfr and comt gene but can only afford one product, what would you suggest? I know food and lifestyle are first and for most. 
We all have the MTHFR and COMT gene :)

What are you looking to support most - what is your primary goal? What are you struggling with?

Best,
Dr. Lynch

My daughter (5) has enlarged tonsils that cause her to snore at night. Her CBC also showed low red blood cell count and low hematocrit. She is often tired and irritable. I (her mother) have a history of low b12 and folate levels. Could this methyl b12 and glutathione help with her large tonsils and mood? What would be the dose for a 5 year old? 

Great questions and good thoughts.

A lot RBC count and low hematocrit can be iron or folate deficiency or both.

A few things here:

  • enlarged tonsils are often associated with either an infection or food intolerance or food allergy
  • consider stopping all cow dairy for 2 weeks and all gluten for 2 weeks and see how she does
  • replace the cow dairy with goat milk (Meyenberg goat milk tastes great), goat cheese (Costco has a firm goat cheese Manchego)
  • use gluten-free bread, gluten-free pancake mix, corn tortillas, lettuce wraps
  • Glutathione Plus: 1/4 a lozenge upon waking
  • Optimal Electrolyte: 1/2 a scoop in a glass of filtered water upon waking and again midday
  • Kids Multivitamin Chewable MF: 1/2 a chewable after a protein based breakfast - do not give after a snack or meal. This has iron, B12 and folate.
  • Iron Chewable: 1 chewable with her breakfast
  • Immune Intensive: 1/2 a teaspoon after dinner

That should help a lot. Keep me posted.

In health,
Dr. Lynch



Hi Doctor Ben! I'm getting ready to start your Methyl B12 w/ L-Methylfolate. After working up to 1 Lozenge per day, is it ok to take that longterm along with a B Complex? (I have Ortho Molecular's Methyl B Complex on hand,...). I have 1 copy of the MTHFR SNP and am working with gut support to heal histamine intolerance. Your wisdom and supplemants have been SO helpful!! Thanks so much, Carole 

You're welcome ;) Happy to help!

I caution you to use so many B vitamins if struggling with histamine intolerance.

Here's something to consider:

  • Methyl B12 with Methylfolate: use 1/4 to 1 lozenge as needed. Do not think you need it everyday. If you feel good, head clear and good mood, do not take it.
  • Histamine Nutrients: take 1 to 2 capsules any time of day or night. Take before bed to support a healthy onset of sleep and during the day to support healthy histamine levels.* This has many B vitamins in it so do not use your B Complex.
  • ProBiota HistaminX: 1 capsule after dinner to support healthy histamine in the gut microbiome.*
  • Optimal Electrolyte: take 1 to 3 servings a day to support healthy hydration which is KEY for histamine balance.*

Start here and keep me posted.

Too many people over do B vitamins and struggle because of it.

I want to see you thriving ;)

In health,
Dr. Lynch



Hi! I am writing to see if I can help my father in law. He had bypass surgery last Wednesday. He is currently in afib now (heart rate running around 122 so its hard for him to walk as he’s supposed to) and his rbc, hematocrit, and hemoglobin are all low. While I know you cannot give medical advice because you don’t know his health history or other medications, I'm just wondering if there are things that might help support his body in a healthy direction. He is drinking 1 serving of optimal electrolytes per day. I was wondering if this lozenge would help since he was under anesthesia for so long and also bc it seems he must have low iron (hopefully checking that today). If you are not comfortable suggesting anything I understand, but thought I would reach out! Thank you! 

I'm helping out by answering some of the questions we are receiving.

I'm sorry to hear about your father-in-law :(. My father went through the same a few years ago.

Just remember, it's common for blood markers to be very 'out' post-surgery. Often they look different a few weeks later. Surgery is a huge stress on the body.

Here are some suggestions:

  • Continue with the Optimal Electrolyte.
  • Optimal Iron (if his iron ends up being low): 1 capsule per day
  • Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate: 1 lozenge per day
  • Glutathione Plus Lozenge or Liposomal Glutathione Plus. Research shows that glutathione levels decrease a lot post-surgery. It's typically short-lived, but you may still want to consider this.*

You may also consider more long-term:

  • Pre-Workout Nutrients to support blood flow.
  • CoQ10 to support healthy heart function.

Make sure to discuss any supplement changes with his healthcare provider.

All the best :)
Elizma Lambert (ElizmaLambert.com)


Dr. Lynch, thank you for the informative, detailed MTHFR/Methylation webinar on Wednesday. I have a question for you on optimizing energy/mood. Despite cleaning up my genes, I am continually dragging. Per Oura ring data (which I leave in airplane mode except for a 15-minute sync each morning) I'm logging optimal sleep, readiness, and activity scores, so I feel like I should rise each morning feeling less wrecked. My house is hard wired, so I have less exposure to nnEMF that most people I know. I am actively working to reverse insulin resistance (single-ingredient/whole foods, very low carb, moderate protein, 1-2 meals a day, fast for at least 16 hrs), get regular exposure to natural light, some red light therapy when I remember, and I use a Sperti D lamp from Oct-May. I know we aren’t supposed to “treat” our SNPs, but it can be challenging to identify which symptom I need to resolve/pulse, given an overall feeling of malaise. I’d love to know what you might recommend to boost mood and energy, which may motivate me out of my rut. If this helps inform your input, I currently take your glutathione lozenge and D3/K2 drops every morning. I cycle Homocysteine Nutrients with Multivitamin One each week. And your histamine supplements are a part of my daily life (Digest, Nutrients, and ProBiota HistaminX). After watching the MTHFR webinar, I ordered Optimal Electrolytes and Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate, as my homocysteine levels are traditionally 12+, to be tested again in 2 weeks. Per the Strategene report, my notable SNPs are: NAT2 (Haplotype intermediate. TH (fast), DRD2 (slow/fast/slow), COMT (Haplotype intermediate), SLC18A1 (slow). MTNR1B (slow), CYP1A2 (contextual), UGT1A (Haplotype contextual). MTHFR (very slow 30%). MTRR & PEMT (slow), PON1 (contextual). GSTA1 (very slow), GST01(fast), NOX/CYBA(fast). GCH1 (slow Haplotype slow) 

You're welcome ;)

Glad you enjoyed the webinar.

I suspect you're not eating enough. Not eating enough can leave you dragging.

Consider:

  • Acetyl-L-Carnitine: 1 capsule upon waking
  • Brain Nutrients: 1/2 to 1 lozenge in the morning upon waking and alternate this possible with the Methyl B12 with Methylfolate lozenge to see which works best for you
  • Optimal Electrolyte: 1 serving upon waking
  • Dopamine Nutrients OR Serotonin Nutrients: I suspect you'd do well with either of these but I'd get both and see which one suits you best on a particular day. I'd say Dopamine Nutrients combined with 1/2 a lozenge of Brain Nutrients in the morning is likely going to be the better fit for you.
  • Fish Oil: 1 capsule after dinner
  • Histamine Nutrients and Histamine Digest: use as needed. Don't use if not as too much of this can reduce your motivation as histamine supports alertness.

This should help a lot.

Keep me posted.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


My husband was directed to take 15mg of methylfolate with his SSRI because of his MTFR gene. I am noticing that the dosage of methylfolate is alot lower in the Seeking Health supplements. Is there a reason? I know the sublingual version would be better absorbed, and can not find one that is anywhere close to 15 mg anywhere. Would taking this be enough? 

Wow! 15mg of methylfolate is a lot to be honest, especially in one go. I would be reluctant to prescribe this much without trying it first.

I would also be really surprised if he needed that much. Most folate supplements only contain 500mcg, maximum 1mg of methylfolate. Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate contains 800mcg which is a good dose.

Start with 1 lozenge first. It's likely to be enough for your husband. You can always build it up with L-Methylfolate if needed.

If he feels more anxious on L-Methylfolate then consider switching to Folinic Acid instead.

I would also consider:

  • Brain Nutrients at 2 lozenges per day.

This helps to support MTHFR and serotonin production.*

Regards,
Elizma Lambert (Elizma Lambert.com)


Hi! I have a hard time understanding some things regarding MTHFR, but I am learning and listening to every podcast I can find. We have not done genetic testing before, but I feel pretty certain that my husband and I both have it and our 4 kids who suffer from a bunch of issues, like EOE, food allergies, mold illness, CIRS, chronic lyme, gluten ataxia, anxiety and much more, have it from both of us, MTHFR homozygous. We will do the testing as soon as we can afford, but until then I hope to support us all the best I can. Years ago I started using Orthomolecular Methyl B Complex, when our functional medicine doctor told me she suspected I was MTHFR and I loved it. After listening to some of your interviews, I ordered an optimized folate and a methylcobalamin, but then I heard you say to use them everyday, but try to listen to your body. I am trying, but it is hard. I want to also support the kids, my 14 and 12 year olds could definitely use the support in school for focus and endurance. I am tired all the time, the last think I want to do is over methylate and be more tired. I don't want to unknowingly make myself worse or the kids! I heard maybe hydroxocobalamin or adenosylcobalamin are the way to go to that you don't overstimulate your methyl or whatever. Are these good for the MTHFR people? I think you have one that says no methyl, is that good? Also interested in the PPQ, do I need to take that with a separate CoQ10? And is it ok to try TMG, it sounds like it helps! Thank you so much! 

You missed an excellent webinar tonight specifically addressing MTHFR :)

It's recorded and available for Members in our Education portal.

Become a member here:
https://www.seekinghealth.com/products/membership

I highly recommend you watch it -

First things first:

  • I don't think trying a bunch of supplements is the right thing to do at the moment.
  • Read Dirty Genes - it comes with the Membership - along with access to the webinar recordings and future webinars.

To help you get started, consider:

  • Glutathione Plus Lozenge: 1/2 to 1 lozenge upon waking in the morning -all of you. And again likely 1/2 to 1 in the afternoon.
  • Optimal Electrolyte: 1/2 to 1 scoop in the morning after the glutathione and again in the afternoon for all of you
  • Vitamin D3+K2: 1 capsule after dinner for all of you.
  • Histamine Digest: 1 capsule with meals - for those with food allergies and sensitivities as it supports a healthy histamine level in the gut.*
  • ProBiota HistaminX: 1 capsule after dinner to support a healthy histamine microbiome.*

The Glutathione Plus has some PQQ in it.

Start with the foundations above. Then check in a couple weeks and let's refine it.

Definitely get the Membership so you can start really learning in depth and not be guessing.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


How does one know if Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate is more appropriate for them vs. Hydroxycobalamin with folinic acid without genetic testing? Does high homocysteine in bloodwork point to which one is better? 

Genetic testing does not necessarily provide the answer to which form of B12 and folate is best for you. Neither does high homocysteine.

The best way to determine is to monitor how the different forms make you feel.

Some individuals do great with methylated forms of B12 and folate. Others may find it too stimulating which can make them feel irritable. If this is the case then hydroxycobalamin and folinic acid may be better choices.

Start with 1/2 a lozenge first of Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate and see how you go before taking a full lozenge.

It's good to also know that hydroxycobalamin can convert to methylcobalamin and folinic acid to L-methylfolate.

Hope this helps :)

Regards,
Elizma Lambert (ElizmaLambert.com)


What is the ratio of Methyl and Adenysol in this product? 

It's proprietary but there is more methyl than adeno.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


Love seeking health, looking for a little help, I had few tests ran and I have mthfr gene, and they said that my methylation pathway is also blocked, I have huge histamine problems, skin, insomnia ,headaches, very painful skin ,this has been going on for over 8 months, I have suspected mcas, my question is, would I be better with a multivitamin or a form of methylfolate, to support methylation ,as probably why cant get histamine down I also have a dao enzyme tested which come back, 3.6 so super low, any advice is much appreciated many thanks in advance 

If your DAO enzyme came back low, I'd add in:

  • Histamine Digest: take 1 capsule with meals
  • ProBiota HistaminX: 1 capsule after dinner

This is in addition to the other recommendations.

Keep me posted.

In health,
Dr. Lynch



Advice Hi there I have the mthfr gene, and I'm unsure if I should be taking this methyl folate or something other, I have mast cell issues after a virus along with terrible insomnia, someone did say he had great effect with this product can someone offer advice please? many thanks 

It's hard to say who is the best candidate for this supplement.

It's more a trial to know for sure.

It's also useful at times vs daily.

I had the virus and after the virus, I found that I needed a lot of this supplement and it really helped me.

Now I use it once a week and right after the virus, I used about 7 of them a day spread out throughout the day.

Poor methylation, due to low methylfolate and low methylcobalamin, can lead to mast cell issues. This supplement supports healthy methylation.*

Consider:

  • Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate: take 1 lozenge in the morning upon waking IF you feel tired, brain fog and low energy as it supports healthy energy and mood.* If you notice benefit, and the benefit wears off in an hour or so, take another one. Repeat as needed.
  • Optimal Electrolyte: 1 serving upon waking
  • Histamine Nutrients: 2 capsules before bed
  • Fish Oil: 1 capsule before bed

In health,
Dr. Lynch

Being MTHFR 1298C Heterozygous I started taking this product a week ago and my when my blood test came back today my Folate serum level was above 24.000 ng/ml and my Homocysteine was high at 18.8. Should I being looking at supplementing with something else and/or adding to this product. Thanks 

Hi Tim -

Homocysteine high is the most important point here along with the high folate.

This tells me that your folate is stuck and is not helping recycle the homocysteine.

Consider:

  • Glutathione Plus: 1 lozenge upon rising in the morning to support healthy glutathione levels which is needed to support homocysteine metabolism.*
  • Homocysteine Nutrients: 1 capsule with breakfast
  • Methyl B12 with L Methylfolate: 1 lozenge around lunch time.
  • Fish Oil: 1 capsule after dinner
  • watch your intake of protein. Enjoy it but just don't eat excessive amounts. 1 gram of protein per pound of body weight is a lot. 1 gram of protein per 2 pounds of body weight is borderline too low.

Check back in a month with new lab findings.

Important: When taking folate supplements, you need to watch out for getting irritable or headaches. If you're getting these, then you need to reduce how much you are taking.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


Hi, I have had vertigo/dizziness for 3.5 years. I’ve been told I have a vestibular disorder and most likely the MTHFR gene. I cannot get the dizziness to go away! I’ve been told that taking B12 might help as my bloodwork shows it being on the lower end of normal. Would you recommend this supplement and if not, what would you recommend to help with 24/7 dizziness and frequent vertigo? 

Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate will help improve your B12 levels, so definitely recommend it if your B12 levels are not optimal.

Vestibular vertigo has a few different causes such as:

  • Viral infections
  • Allergies, high histamine
  • Poor circulation to the ear
  • Traumatic brain injury

B12 deficiency can result in reduced blood flow to and from the brain which can make vertigo worse.*

You may also try something like Histamine Nutrients 1 capsule twice a day.

Let us know how you go :).

Regards,
Elizma Lambert (ElizmaLambert.com)


Hi there, my son is almost 2 and is having trouble going to sleep at night. I read it could be due to low b vitamin levels. He was also born with a tongue tie, sacral dimple, and stork bite so I’m assuming he has some sort of MTHFR but we have not gotten him tested. Would this be a good supplement for him to take? If so what would the dosing be like? Thank you for your help. 

There are many factors for sleep issues.

Consider:

  • turning off WiFi in the house
  • no screens at least 1 hour before bed
  • no dessert after dinner or have way less
  • make sure he gets a fair bit of exercise during the day
  • high histamine foods or drinks in the evening so go lower histamine (look at our Histamine Workbook)
  • Kids Multivitamin Chewable MF: 1/2 a chewable with breakfast is the best way to support overall nutrition of B vitamins, trace minerals and some antioxidants.*
  • Optimal Electrolyte: 1/2 scoop any time during the day but not within 5 hours of bedtime to support hydration.* Kids don't drink water and we need to get them to do so. Orange and Berry are popular.
  • ProBiota HistaminX: 1 capsule after dinner to support healthy histamine levels in his gut and blood as histamine is associated with inability to sleep.* You can open the capsule and put on a bite of food.
  • Magnesium Malate Chewable: 1 capsule before bed to support healthy sleep.*

In health,
Dr. Lynch


Hi there. I have the MTHFR gene turned red in my report I received. The rs1801131 (A1298C) was red. The "SOD2" (rs4880 (VAL16ALA)), "FUT2", and "FAAH", "DRD2" (rs6277 (C957T)) is also red. I have had hashimotos and have healed it from detoxing and parasite cleansing. I have an ok amount of energy but I am having a hard time losing weight. I also get headaches sometimes and not quite migraines but I can feel my nervous system and gut almost go there. Wondering what you would recommend to take for maintenance? 

I'd start with some fundamentals before we hit specifics.

Consider:

  • Glutathione Plus lozenges: 1/2 to 1 lozenge upon waking and possibly another one later in the day when your head starts feeling a bit heavy as it supports healthy neurotransmission.*
  • Brain Nutrients: consider 1/2 a lozenge when you feel a headache coming on as it supports healthy blood flow and healthy neurotransmission.*
  • Optimal Electrolyte: often times people are dehydrated and low potassium or low sodium which contributes to headaches. Consider 1 to 3 servings a day and I'd also add a 1/4 tsp additional salt which is another 500 mg of sodium.
  • Gallbladder Nutrients: 2 capsules before dinner to support healthy bile production and bile flow which is a must to support healthy weight.*
  • Fish Oil: 1 capsule after dinner
  • ProBiota HistaminX: 1 capsule after dinner
  • have protein with each meal

Keep me posted.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


How can I use this to improve my sleep? And do you have any other recommandations? 

You'd take this in the morning before your breakfast to support healthy onset of sleep.

Sleep is multifactorial.

Supporting healthy onset of sleep:

  • Take this supplement in the morning to support healthy onset of sleep in the evening.*
  • Histamine Nutrients: take 1-2 capsules before bed to support healthy histamine levels which are key to balance for healthy onset of sleep.*
  • Lithium Orotate: take 1 capsule before bed to support a sense of healthy calmness to support healthy onset of sleep.*
  • Phosphatidyl Serine: take 1 capsule before bed to support healthy cortisol levels if cortisol is high as high cortisol prevents healthy onset of sleep.*

To support healthy duration and extended sleep:

  • Adrenal Cortex: take 1 capsule with breakfast to support healthy duration of sleep IF, and only IF, you woke up way too early in the morning, woke up really tired or woke up a few times to pee during the night. Otherwise, do not take it.
  • Serotonin Nutrients: take 1 capsule before bed to support healthy duration of sleep.

General health support which supports healthy sleep:

  • Fish Oil: take 1 capsule after dinner
  • ProBiota HistaminX: take 1 capsule after dinner
  • Gallbladder Nutrients: take 2 capsules before dinner (sounds weird but very supportive of healthy sleep)
  • Optimal Electrolyte: supports healthy hydration and thus supporting healthy frequency of urination.*

These are general recommendations and use them as needed and only as needed.

I listed a variety of them as every one is slightly different and at different times one needs different support.

I'm not saying take all of these at once - far from - just giving options.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


Hi, What blood test should i do b9 or folic acid? To know what my range is? Thank you 

Folate blood testing is tricky.

Serum folate is a common one to order.

Know that serum folate includes all forms of folate including folic acid.

Looking at the CBC's MCV and MCH is another way to get a gauge on red blood cell health which requires healthy levels of B12 and folate. High MCV and High MCH is associated with low folate and/or low B12.

Know that folic acid can mask (hide) a vitamin B12 deficiency so be mindful of that.

I do not ever recommend anyone to take folic acid.

Use folinic acid or methylfolate or the combination of them both instead.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


I am taking Methyl B12 but have a heavy feeling like my B12 is low. My labs show my B12 is in the high range. Which of your B12 should I take if I have MTHFR C677T and A1298C (both heterozygous) and COMT V158M and H62H (both homozygous)? Thanks in advance! Ann Lolley 

Taking vitamin B12 without methylfolate may be ineffective as it may lead to methyl trapping.

Methyl trapping will lead to increased levels of homocysteine and methylation issues as a result.

Methyl trapping occurs if:

  • one has sufficient vitamin B12 but not enough methylfolate
  • one has sufficient methylfolate but not enough B12
  • one has sufficient methylfolate, B12 but has oxidative stress due to low glutathione and antioxidants
  • one has sufficient methylfolate, B12, glutathione but high levels of heavy metals
  • one has sufficient methylfolate, B12, glutathione but is exposed to laughing gas (nitrous oxide) for a period of time

That list is not exhaustive but it's pretty thorough.

A combination of MTHFR compound heterozygous with a slow COMT means one has to be mindful of how much magnesium they have on board, how much homocysteine and be mindful how they are feeling when they are supplementing with methyl donors.

Consider:

  • Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate lozenge: 1/2 to 1 upon waking in the morning first thing and possibly another 1/2 if needing more support around midday - you'll know.
  • Glutathione Plus Lozenges: 1/2 to 1 lozenge first thing in the morning upon waking
  • Optimal Electrolyte: sip 1 serving over a 15 minute period or so first thing in the morning upon waking
  • Optimal Magnesium: 1 capsule before bed

This combination is very supportive.

Take these supplements on an as-needed basis. If you wake up feeling great, just take a bit of the Glutathione and possibly 1/2 scoop of the Optimal Electrolyte and skip the Methyl B12 and Methylfolate.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


Can you take this every day with Brain Nutrients? You can but do you need to is the question.

If you need it, absolutely go for it.

What's important is to first realize how you are feeling, then take one of the supplements, see how you feel from taking that and evaluating if you need additional support or not.

For me, I usually take 1/2 to 1 lozenge of Brain Nutrients in the morning upon waking - first thing in the morning.

This makes me feel pretty good for an hour or so then I make a glass of Optimal Electrolyte and sip that at my desk for about an hour or so.

If I feel my brain underperform, then I could either take a Methyl B12 with Methylfolate Lozenge (1/2) or another 1/2 to 1 lozenge of Brain Nutrients. I usually use Brain Nutrients and I have it on my desk along with Optimal Focus and Optimal Electrolyte.

What you want to feel is good: good energy, good mood, good cognitive abilities.

If you feel you need more support, then add it.

If you feel good, then skip it.

In health,
Dr. Lynch

Regarding sublingual B12 (all versions you carry), I have recently been told that the vitamin B12 molecule is too large to be absorbed sublingually. Can you tell me your understanding? Thank you! Kim 

Research shows that sublingual delivery of many nutrients is effective.

Is sublingual MORE effective? That's to be debated as some research says yes and others say it's as effective as the oral route or a shot in the arm.
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11845-023-03602-4

We call these lozenges as they deliver the B12 in your mouth and then you swallow.

The great thing about our lozenges:

  • you can control how much you are getting
  • you often feel the effects from them far more quickly than swallowing a capsule
  • kids enjoy them
  • don't have to swallow a pill

In health,
Dr. Lynch


Hi! My husband has severe obstructive sleep apnea caused by his underbite and high vaulted pallet that prevents his tongue from resting in the proper position. I would not be surprised if he had an MTHFR mutation but if he doesn't, his genes are certainly acting dirty. He has chronic migraines, weight gain, foggy brain, ADHD-like symptoms, and never feels well-rested. He does not tolerate his c-pap machine well so the only alternative is jaw surgery and a pallet expansion to fix the underbite and allow his tongue to rest in the proper position so that it stops falling over his airway at night. Until then, which supplements which you recommend to alleviate the sleep apnea symptoms, particularly the migraines? We eat a pretty nutrient dense diet of high quality meats, dairy, eggs, and organic vegetables but it doesn't seem to be enough to overcome just how depleted he is. Thanks so much for your help and insight! 

If the migraines are caused by low oxygen, then we need to support healthy oxygen levels and healthy oxidative stress levels.

Some things to consider:

  • Optimal Electrolyte: sip one serving upon waking up in the morning and likely another one during the day
  • Brain Nutrients: take 1/2 to 1 lozenge immediately upon waking before or after the electrolyte.
  • Optimal Focus: take 1 to 3 capsules with breakfast 5 days a week with 2 days off to support healthy acetylcholine levels which support healthy focus and cognition and memory.*

I'd start here.

He may also do well with adding in 2 capsules of Optimal Man with a protein based breakfast but let's start with the above first.

ProBiota HistaminX after dinner along with Fish Oil could also be useful as a foundation.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


My 4 year daughter was diagnosed with MTHFR. I She is struggling with extreme nail biting (anxiety) and has a really hard time regulating herself when she gets upset. I haven't wanted to go the supplement route but I feel like i may be doing her a disservice. What dosage amount would you suggest with this product for her? Thanks so much! 

I'd consider a couple options.

Nail biting, called onychophagia, is associated with low serotonin levels.

Consider:

  • Brain Nutrients: 1/4 to 1/2 a lozenge immediately upon waking up in the morning. See how she does with this.
  • Serotonin Nutrients: 1/2 a capsule mixed in a bite of food in the morning or before bed or as needed if you see symptoms present to support healthy serotonin levels.*

Give one or the other first - do not give both at once as it will be too much.

I also recommend giving her 1/2 scoop of Optimal Electrolyte mixed in a glass of filtered water.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


Is the adeno b12 suitable for an 8 year old? My son’s dr recommended he take b12. What dose is correct for kids? Can he do half the amount that’s recommended for adults? 

For a child that is growing, I'd instead use Hydroxo B12 with Folinic Acid Lozenges and give him 1/4 a lozenge.

OR

Consider the Kids Multivitamin Chewable MF as it supports your son's B12, folate and other key nutrients as well.

You would not do both.

If your son has very low vitamin B12, then I'd consider 1/2 a lozenge of Methyl B12 1000 and give him 1 lozenge after breakfast in addition to 1/2 to 1 chewable of Kids Multivitamin Chewable MF.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


Hi there my mam was diagnosed with cancer and needs chemo and radiotherapy,she was reccomended to start taking folate acid ,can you please reccomend best one many thanks 

My best to your mother.

Often times oncologists recommend Folic Acid for their patients taking Methotrexate or other folate blocking medications.

Folic acid is the wrong form of folate to use.

The folate that should be used is Folinic Acid.
https://www.seekinghealth.com/products/folinic-acid

If she starts experiencing mouth sores or painful stomach, consider Gut Nutrients as it supports a healthy mucous lining. She would mix a serving of Gut Nutrients in about 4 oz of filtered water. She would sip, hold, swish, hold and then swallow. Repeat.

The relief is pretty fast and very important as radiation is known to cause mouth sores and gut sores.

She would not use the Gut Nutrients if she is not experiencing these - OR she can take 1 serving before getting the chemo and radiation.

She can also just use L-Glutamine Powder as I see you in the UK. That is likely the better option to use. Do that instead actually. It's not recommended to take antioxidants (as found in Gut Nutrients) during chemo or radiation.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


I have a MTHFR, adrenal fatigue, non alcohol fatty liver, inflammation, and other issues. Which supplements would you recommend I take? Thank you! 

I recommend talking with one of our health professionals in our referral network.

There are many lifestyle things that should be evaluated prior to supplementation.

Reading my book, Dirty Genes, is also a great place to start.

For a foundation and starter pack, I do recommend:

  • 1/2 a lozenge of Glutathione Plus Lozenges and take upon waking first thing in the morning
  • 1 serving of Optimal Electrolyte with added 1/2 tsp of salt in filtered water. Sip it.
  • 1 capsule of Calcium-D-Glucarate after dinner to support healthy bowel movements and detoxification.*

Make sure you start your day with protein - not coffee or sugar. Eggs, meat, whey or collagen protein smoothie.

These three are a great foundational start for you.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


Dr. Lynch, Could you help me with trying to figure out what to do about high homocysteine (for the past 20 years)? Currently it runs between 13 and 17 and it is currently 17. I clearly have methylation issues >> I am 66, female, also have Hypothyroidism, Depression, and Histamine intolerance. I had 3 miscarriages after 1 normal birth. How could I be taking the following for many years everyday and not see a change in my Homocysteine level? L-methyl folate - 3500 mcg, DFE, 2100 mcg 5 MTHF; TMG Betaine - 4300 mg; Methyl B complex, N-AC- 2000mg, Liposomal Glutathione, Taurine, 3000mg. Not a big meat eater and very poor compliance with leafy greens- but trying. What am I missing? (You are one of the best- trying to help people with your knowledge and expertise while other doctors? - not so much). Thank you! 

That's a great question.

Do you know your genetics? I suspect you have some genes which are very dirty and it would be nice to know which ones they are.

I'm curious if you have tried a 24 hour filtered water fast only and seeing if your homocysteine levels normalize.

That is something I would do.

I'd also consider adding in Creatine and Phosphatidylcholine.

I am not sure which companies you are buying these from and that may be an issue- or maybe not.

Consider stopping all of those for now and switching to Seeking Health's to see if the quality makes a difference - and the synergy of ingredients.

I'd consider starting your morning with Brain Nutrients. Have it right on your bed stand and take 1 full lozenge immediately upon waking up in the morning. This is full of potent antioxidants along with some additional folate and B12, ATP and thiamine.

I'd consider Homocysteine Nutrients and take 2 capsules with breakfast.

Then, sip a glass of Optimal Electrolyte - or put 2 scoops in a liter water bottle with filtered water. Sip this over an hour or more.

Before bed, I'd take 2 capsules of Optimal PC. I like chewing the capsules but everyone is different. You can swallow them but it's fun and the phosphatidylcholine tastes good and salty.

Add in sauna. Detoxify.

Here's how to sauna:
https://www.seekinghealth.com/blogs/education/sauna-benefits-how-to-guide

Make sure you are fasting before you measure your homocysteine levels and do them in the morning - and at the same time.

I suspect the histamine intolerance may be partially contributing here as histamine breakdown can increase homocysteine - depending on how significant it is.

After dinner, take a capsule of ProBiota HistaminX.

Before bed, take 2 capsules of Histamine Nutrients.

Follow up in a month or so after implementing this and you get your new homocysteine levels back.

Make sure you are not over exercising as well as exercise increases homocysteine. Go for walks and hikes - but no high intensity exercise.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


I used to take L-Methylfolate Lozenges from you guys, but i can't find that product online. Is it only available now to take with B12? I have tested as deficient and low in Folate. Will it be ok for me to take this with the Methyl B12 included? Last time i checked my B12 levels were just adequate but im not 100% sure. All i know is that i need to start taking Folate ASAP, as i tested low and i have symptoms of dizziness and focusing my eyes so im concerned its the low folate causing this. 

I highly recommend you consider Brain Nutrients in addition to Optimal Man.

Here's why:

  • Brain Nutrients supports you with some folate, B12 and a lot of antioxidants which seems like you need based on your eye and symptoms. Consider starting with 1/2 to 1 lozenge first thing in the morning upon waking.

  • Optimal Man is a comprehensive multivitamin with folate and B12 and lots of other key nutrients. Take 2 capsules with a protein based breakfast. Only take 2 more capsules in the afternoon if you feel tired. You may find that some afternoons you need more support and other afternoons you don't. I suspect you will need 2 capsules with breakfast and 2 with lunch for a couple weeks. Then, you'll likely think to yourself - wow, I feel good this afternoon. In that case, do not take more.

Too much folate and B12 can increase irritability and anxiousness and we don't want that.

I'd also drink a serving or two of Optimal Electrolyte. SIP it in your water bottle over time - do not chug it. It works best when sipped over time. Use filtered water always.

If you're working on a computer all day like I am, consider getting blue light blocking glasses. I'm wearing prescription blue blockers right now and have been using them for years.

Very handy and healthy for your eyes. I get mine at BonCharge here - https://boncharge.com/?rfsn=3416137.6ced97 - use code DRBENLYNCH to save 15% (I earn a commission).

These recommendations should help you a lot.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


I'm looking for a complete ingredients list. Some of your products have it as a label picture and others a link that shows the label. I am not seeing either for this (and a few other) SH products. What is the full list of ingredients? 

Thank you.

We just updated the product page and some are missing.

I notified the team and we will get this remedied for all products by Friday.

Best,
Dr. Lynch


I am doing very well with Methylated B12 but can't tolerate Methylfolate. I'm confused! Why can I tolerate one but not the other? The practitioner said I may be over methylating and would do better to take both B12 and folate non methylated. Could I continue with the B12 and address folate needs via food and/or non methyl folate supplement? I've had a test which says I have one copy of C6777T and up to to 40% reduction in gene function (there were many mutations in the test). 

It may be because you don't need additional folate.

Just because you have the MTHFR variation does not necessitate you to take methylfolate.

You may be obtaining sufficient folate from your diet and not enough B12.

If you feel fine, your lab tests are fine, then you are fine - don't take methylfolate.

Continue with the Methyl B12 without folates ;)

If your MCV and MCH are elevated signifying anemia, then you want to use Folinic Acid in addition to your Methyl B12
https://www.seekinghealth.com/products/folinic-acid-lozenge-60-lozenges

Do NOT supplement based on genetic variations. That's harmful.

I own a supplement company and I am telling you that. It hurts my business - but it helps you. :)

Read Dirty Genes - that will help you a lot.
https://www.seekinghealth.com/products/dirty-genes-by-dr-ben-lynch

In health,
Dr. Lynch


My doctor said I'm B12 (and Vitamin D) deficient. My number was 400 so she wants me to take 1000mcg of B12. I know your brand is reputable so I started taking it 5 days ago and for the last 4ish days my lips have been peeling, burning and the corners of my mouth as cracking. Google says it's a B12 deficiency but it didn't start until after I started the B12 supplement. Do you have any advice? Is there a better B supplement for me considering I have MTHFR? Thank you for any help you can provide, I'm so tired of navigating this world. Who knows what I need to detox after 20 years in the Navy. 

Are you taking only the B12 or the B12 with Methylfolate?

One doesn't supplement based on their SNPs. They supplement based on their need - such as a low level of a nutrient found in a lab test or particular symptoms.

You may have a significant MTHFR variant but be absolutely fine and not need any support.

Since your B12 levels are on the lower end, then I agree, you need to use some B12.

Are you using this one - Methyl B12 1000:
https://www.seekinghealth.com/products/methyl-b12-1000

If so, consider biting it a few times, then swallowing it.

Cracks in the sides of the mouth are usually due to a Riboflavin deficiency (B2).

Perhaps consider using our Multivitamin One MF in addition to the Methyl B12 1000 lozenge
https://www.seekinghealth.com/products/multivitamin-one-mf

Sometimes when you replenish a B12 deficiency, other vitamins get depleted quite quickly.

Take 1 capsule of the Multivitamin One MF with a protein based breakfast every other day or on an as-needed basis. Use it only when you feel you need additional nutritional support - which is often seen as needing healthy energy, healthy mood and healthy cognitive abilities.*

In health,
Dr. Lynch


Trying to understand WHY there is NOT one of this product with a much higher MG count? 1 milligram is definitely NOT near enough. I am looking for at least 15mg if not higher. I do have the gene mutations from EACH parent... so I do need more. BUT even if it was just the one mutation... this would not even do. Confused as to why this would be it... I PREFER to use Seeking Health since I have followed Ben Lynch since 2016, and I KNOW these vitamins have NO folic acid... but I AM really saddened that this has NOT been upgraded yet? thanks for any reply that can help. 

Dosage requirements are not based on SNPs.

I have the MTHFR compound heterozygous variation myself.

I rarely take this lozenge as it's powerful.

I use Optimal Man and take 2 capsules with breakfast. That's only 100 mcg of MTHF and 100 mcg of folinic acid.

We used to offer 5 mg and 15 mg MTHF but I stopped offering them.

Try this lozenge and see how you feel. I'm confident you will feel it.

If you don't, then I'd add in Brain Nutrients Lozenge and start with just 1/2 a lozenge upon waking.

If your homocysteine levels are elevated, then look into Homocysteine Nutrients to support healthy homocysteine levels.*

Homocysteine levels are essentially what dictate how much MTHF you need - not how many SNPs you have. Even that, one may have high homocysteine due to low glutathione, low B6, low B12, etc.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


I am a 59 year old Caucasian, female who weighs 103 pounds and height is 5'3. I have taken this product- one lozengier a day- for since 2014. It was prescribed for me by my psychiatrist after learning I have Heterozygous (both the C677T and A1298C are mutated). Recently, I was hospitalized for a week in a Behavior Mental Health Unit due to insomnia. I noticed a "common sign from taking too much glutathione or taking it too frequently" listed Difficulty Sleeping. Am I taking too much for my size and weight? How do I know what is proper for me? 

It's not about height and weight or age. It's more about your lifestyle, food, environment.

I would absolutely pause using this supplement for now and see how you feel.

You can always restart it if needed.

I highly suspect you are right to suspect this being the culprit to your insomnia.

You can take Niacin 50 mg right now to help support a healthy response to too much methylfolate.*
https://www.seekinghealth.com/products/niacin

Be sure to take Niacin with some food.

Use the Methyl B12 with Methylfolate when you feel you need additional healthy mood, cognitive or energy support.*

If you are already experiencing those, then you don't need to take it.

You may also find that you may do better with the Brain Nutrients Lozenge. Don't start this now as I don't want you using any B12 or folate for at least a week.

If you do switch to Brain Nutrients, start with just 1/4 lozenge upon waking to support a clear head, healthy energy and healthy cognition.*

In health,
Dr. Lynch


Does consuming THC Gel tabs daily (used to stimulate appetite in person with ARFID) conflict with benefits of this product: Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate? 

I wouldn't say they conflict but they may necessitate the increased need for it.

You may also find that Brain Nutrients Lozenge may be more supportive if needed - or a combination of the two.

I can definitely see the THC gel tabs being helpful. Simply use more of the supplement if needed.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


I’ve noticed this product and the B complex plus make my hair very dry and causes some hair loss. Any thoughts on why this might be? I am heterozygous in MTHFR c677t and a1298c. Thanks. 

I am not sure why this would be.

I suspect you may be converting more testosterone to DHT (dihydrotesterone).

Typically B12 and folate support healthy hair along with zinc and biotin and boron.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6380979/

Perhaps stop using the B Complex Plus and the Methyl B12 and Methylfolate lozenges.

Switch to Multivitamin One MF and take with breakfast.
https://www.seekinghealth.com/products/multivitamin-one-mf

The unmethylated forms of B12 and folate are more supportive of hair growth compared to methylated forms.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


Hello, my naturopath told me about you and your book that I will order. I try to have a child but my homocysteine is too high (12,7). I have the two MTHFR mutations in the heterozygous state. Unfortunately, doctors in France do not really know the MTHFR. I took tetrafolic and methyl sam to get vitamin B9 in methylated form but unfortunately my homocysteine continues to increase. I am afraid that this will prevent a pregnancy and I am afraid of the consequences it could have on my child. I don’t understand what keeps my homocysteine down. I see your product and I Wonder what is " methyl sensitive". Maybe, this is my problem but how to know? Have you got a product for me with my MTHFR mutations? I don t know what is better: méthyle B12, prénatal or an other. Thank you very much. Caroline. 

I recommend Prenatal Essentials. Take 1 capsule with breakfast and 1 capsule with lunch.

I also would consider the lozenge you chose here - Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate. Consider taking 1/2 in the morning and 1/2 with lunch.

Additionally, take 1/2 to 1 lozenge of Glutathione Plus lozenge in the morning upon waking up.

If you start getting headaches or irritability, reduce how much Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate you are taking by 50% and also reduce the glutathione by 50%.

In the beginning, you likely will do just fine with the full serving size. As your biochemistry gets supported, you likely won't need as much so you should reduce the amount taken. Your body will tell you - and so will your labs.

Remeasure your homocysteine in 1 month after starting this program.

If you are exercising hard, reduce how much exercise you are doing. This raises homocysteine.

If you are eating a lot of protein, make sure you are not eating more than 1 gram of protein per pound of body weight. Protein makes homocysteine.

If you are a vegan or vegetarian, I highly recommend eating some meat. And you should measure your serum B12 and serum folate levels or what we call here MCH and MCV.

I would also take 1 capsule of Optimal PC after dinner to support healthy cell membranes and healthy homocysteine levels. A lot of homocysteine is made by your body making PC so by taking PC, you may reduce the work your body has to do and thus have healthier homocysteine levels.*

For your partner, have him consider Optimal Man. It supports healthy fertility in men. He would take 2 capsules with breakfast. If he finds he needs additional support in the afternoon, he could take an additional 1-2 capsules with lunch. I usually take 2 capsules in the morning and rarely take more in the afternoon. The serving size is 4 capsules but I personally rarely do it. Every person is different.

We are currently sold out of fish oil but I do recommend finding a good quality fish oil and taking that after dinner.

I wish you well and a happy healthy pregnancy :)

In health,
Dr. Lynch


Hello! I have been taking methylated B12 for around 6 months and realized that I have inadvertently caused MCAS from a high B12 level as well as low Vitamin D. I have terrible skin and the symptoms of low B12 (fatigue, headaches, and neuropathy/raynaud's in hands and feet) has become much worse. I have read your book but feel as though I'm missing an important component to utilizing the b12 in my body. Glutathione? Or should I stop taking it altogether? Any help is appreciated! 

I do believe you're correct in needing glutathione support.

I'd consider the Liposomal Glutathione Plus and the Glutathione Plus Lozenge.

I'd alternate them and see which one performs best for you. Or they both may perform well for you at different times of the day.

I like starting my day with the Glutathione Plus Lozenge. Then if needing more support, you may use another lozenge or you may want to use the Liposomal Glutathione Plus.

I would consider stopping the Methyl B12 with L Methylfolate for now.

Have your doctor test your MCV, MCH, homocysteine and serum B12 levels.

Methyl B12 and methylfolate may contribute to acne, irritability, headaches, joint pain to name a few.

You may want to use the Adeno B12 form as it more is aligned with healthy energy and does not contribute to the side effects mentioned like the Methyl B12 does.
https://www.seekinghealth.com/products/adeno-b12

In health,
Dr. Lynch


Hi there, Is L-Methylfolate okay to take after thyroidectomy and lymph node removal due to cancer? Have MTHFR variant C677T. 

You want to check with your oncologist.

Once you are declared 'cancer-free', then it is a good idea to supplement with folate - but not until then.

I would also look into Glutathione Plus Lozenges - and take 1 upon waking in the morning - but again - not until your oncologist declares you as 'cancer-free'

I also recommend the book, Metabolic Approach to Cancer. It's very good.

In health,
Dr. Lynch



I recently start taking Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate has made a tremendous difference in my mood and anxiety levels throughout the day. I'm also pleased to report that my senior high school child is experiencing similar benefits from the half lozenge Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate with half of Glutathione Plus Lozenges. As she is active in sports, I was wondering if you had any further recommendations to help her perform at best. She tends to overthink and panic before races, and I want to make sure she has all the tools she needs to succeed. Any advice you could offer would be greatly appreciated. 

That's great news ;)

I hear you on the sports and our kids overthinking it.

On race days, consider using 1/4 of the Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate.

Also -

I'd consider having her try - on non-racing days first - 1 capsule of Optimal Focus. If she does well with it, then give it to her at least 1 hour prior to her race.
https://www.seekinghealth.com/products/optimal-focus

Optimal Focus supports the feeling of a CALM FOCUS.

It lasers you in without feeling that angst of a competition.

My boys experience it, too.

When they got on the basketball court during a game, they'd overthink and not play well. During practices, they'd crush it.

Upon giving them a capsule of Optimal Focus an hour before the game, they'd walk in laser focused and with a calm feeling.

On days she is training hard, I'd also have her drink 1/2 a serving of Pre-Workout Nutrients 30 minutes before training - and then sip the rest while she is training for continued periodic support.
https://www.seekinghealth.com/products/pre-workout-nutrients

Optimal Electrolyte is another one.

Use the Unflavored Optimal Electrolyte version and she can mix it in the Pre-Workout Nutrients (tastes like faint lemonade) second 1/2 of her serving and refill her water bottle.
https://www.seekinghealth.com/products/optimal-electrolyte

In health,
Dr. Lynch


Is this safe for kids? I am giving my 7yo 1/4 tablet and feel like it is helpful. I am homozygous MTHFR mutation and am also taking it. Thanks! 

For kids, I recommend:

Some days they may need only 1/2 a chewable and other days may need 1 or more.

I like giving 1/2 a chewable with breakfast and another with lunch.

Do not give past 2 PM as they won't fall asleep well.

This multivitamin has the key nutrients they need - along with the B12 and methylfolate.

You can give your kids the Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate, yes.

That said, only give them 1/4 a lozenge or so. Too much will make them irritable, headaches, sore joints and unable to fall asleep.

I believe the Kids Multivitamin Chewable is the best way to go ;)

In health,
Dr. Lynch


Hello Dr Lynch... would this be helpful for me? I'm 70yr, tested with MTHFR and elevated homocystein levels, but my iridologist always sees my pituitary gland as needing help, always asks if i sleep well, which i don't. I don't seem to feel well on 5-htp, l. triptophane and Gaba. What would you recommend for pituitary issues if not Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate? Thankyou so very much for taking time to help me. 

For elevated homocysteine, you are correct in needing to support a healthy methylation cycle.

Given that you're a wise 70 year old, stomach acid levels tend to be lower than when younger.

I do recommend you use the Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate lozenge.

In the morning upon waking, take start with 1/2 lozenge.

  • Bite it a couple times, allow it to dissolve, hold for a few seconds, then swallow.
  • After 20 minutes, see how your energy levels and mood are.
  • If you feel great, then stay at the 1/2 lozenge.
  • If you feel that your mood is low, your brain power still low and energy levels a bit low, take the other 1/2.
  • Note that some days you will need a full lozenge, sometimes only 1/2 and other days none.

You want your homocysteine levels to be between 7 umol to 9 umol/L.

If there are above 9 umol/L, keep supporting.

You may need to add Homocysteine Nutrients in addition to the Methyl B12 with L-Methylfolate if homocysteine is still not where you want it.

Additional thoughts:

  • start your morning with 1/2 lozenge of Glutathione Plus lozenges. Supports a healthy methylation cycle which supports healthy methylation
  • drink a glass of unflavored Optimal Electrolyte. Sip it in the morning upon waking over a period of 30 minutes or so.

In health,
Dr. Lynch


I’ve been taking this for a while and was curious about the direction. You describe it as a lozenge but a lozenge is typically dissolved in the month. Is it OK to chew instead? 

Thank you for your question! You can let a lozenge melt underneath the tongue, or between the cheek and your back lower tooth. You may chew the lozenge as well if you choose, however these lozenges are intended to be melted in the mouth.

We highly suggest that you re-position the lozenge frequently in the mouth to prevent uncomfortable sensation with the lozenge sitting in the same place for a prolonged period. The mucous membranes in our mouths are very sensitive, and many textures or ingredients can irritate the tissues if its unmoved.


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